During the time when NAMA was dealing with the various property portfolios and issues arising from the work-out of those properties, many questions were asked, many queries were put before NAMA, and many people who had been in business and who found themselves in difficulty after the crash were treated very badly. That is a fact. That is held up by the number of people who appeared before the finance committee and, indeed, by the work of the Committee of Public Accounts. All of those people are being ignored. I am deeply concerned by the way that they were treated and I raised it continuously during the course of that time. I will give one example. This information is in the public domain. Annette De Vere Hunt was one such person. In the case of another individual, a young child in a family who was ill was approached by those who called to the home. It was unacceptable practice. Nothing has ever come out from that organisation to apologise publicly for what went on. Nor has there been any acknowledgement of the wrongdoing of that agency in terms of how it approached its work. Likewise, at the time when some of the bigger property portfolios, particularly in Northern Ireland, were being discussed, very little help and information were given to the committees of this House to enable them to pursue matters in the interests of the citizens of this country. Particular cases were mentioned. What concerns me about this legislation is the fact that when the officials of the Department came before the finance committee, they were outlining their approach to the legislation. It was pointed out to them that they would have to come back to the committee to give details on a case the committee was dealing with, which involved the Butler family. Again, it is in the public domain. I am not breaching anyone's confidence here. They raised many questions not only about their treatment as a family but also about the treatment of their investment going right back to the original loan from the bank. It caused the committee to ask all of these questions and to let the committee hear from the Butler family directly, which we did at that time. I was Chairman of the committee. I would say that most of the members who took on board what was being said were absolutely shocked that the circumstances of their case were not examined. They were also shocked that an agency of the State would not present the facts or deal with the facts that the Butlers were presenting at that time. It was decided that the committee would be briefed from the liquidators' side and that the case would be answered in the context of the facts versus what NAMA or the liquidator had to say. That never happened. In fact, they were to arrange a meeting between some committee members and NAMA relative to how all of this was being exposed publicly, how the facts were being dealt with, if there were facts, and what the case from the other side, which was NAMA, was. That never happened, even though it was promised to an Oireachtas committee representing these Houses. That was before the election. I really thought they would meet with the Butlers and deal with each of the specific accusations or allegations being made, and that each of those allegations would be answered comprehensively. That did not happen. Now we are at a point where the Bill has gone through pre-legislative scrutiny and the specific cases that were of concern, particularly that family from Tipperary, have not been dealt with. This legislation is simply going to be railroaded through this House. Those who have been individually affected by the decisions of NAMA are not going to have the opportunity to be heard. Those who have been heard through the finance committee are not going to be given the opportunity to have all of their questions answered. If their allegations stand up, and there is lots of paperwork around it, that would bring up further questions on other transactions within NAMA that are questionable. The House has been short-changed here in terms of the legislation being rushed through as have the people who have raised queries not being engaged with. Certainly the committee members who showed an interest in the Butler case do not know the outcome. The Minister should at least fulfil the promise of the officials and ensure the details of that meeting as given to the officials are examined. That is the least we should do in the context of this legislation. If that does not happen and we plough ahead with this, we are simply adding further injustice to an injustice to this family. Farms were lost. Investments were lost. The proof is there to be seen. Will the Minister of State make contact with the officials concerned? Will he invite in the Butlers to hear what they have said, or will he read the transcripts from the finance committee meeting? Will he deal with the questions that were raised and the commitments that were given by the officials to the committee members at that time? If he does not do that, the whole process is just meaningless and lacks any form of democracy or compassion as far as I am concerned. That family and others were invited to give their story to the finance committee because it was felt it was that important. During the crash, I saw many things happening to families that were questionable. Many of those queries were raised in various committees of this House. Enough of those queries were raised to give concern to the Government and that concern is not being reflected here. At least one of those families I know of is not being treated properly. That is not the way it should be. The vulture funds and so on entered this country, bought properties and treated people badly and we just took it as being the way it was after the crash. Their behaviour here has been utterly despicable and it continues to this day because of the manner in which those staff were trained. Some of those staff have now moved to mainstream banking with the same culture and attitude they experienced when they were with the vulture funds, dealing with NAMA, closing down operations, closing down families and so on. We do not seem to be concerned about that. It is leading a culture that is a legacy of a different time altogether in Ireland. People are still paying that price. Only this morning I met with families dealing with the vulture funds and whose loans have been transferred. You cannot get information. You cannot get a reasonable person to discuss the issue with you. Everyone is hiding behind GDPR and people are afraid to ask questions. The questions that have been asked should be answered. They will throw light on how other people were treated. We saw this in relation to the tracker mortgage issue. First there were hundreds. The then Governor of the Central Bank, who is now in the European Central Bank, said there were around 5,000 but it was over 50,000. Had it not been for the members of the finance committee pushing and probing on behalf of individual cases, we would not know the extent of that problem. It is a mark on this State that this is the way citizens were treated. It is a mark on the European Union and the European Central Bank that they would have allowed that to happen. Here we are now doing exactly the same thing, short-changing the people we represent, people who have come to us in good faith, asking for support and help. It is not right that they would be ignored. If they are ignored in the context of this Bill and how it is being pushed through the House, then it is a sorry day for Ireland and for the people concerned. I do not raise this lightly or say these things lightly. I say it out of experience on that committee, dealing directly with the people concerned. I am giving the Minister of State the example of the tracker mortgage issue to show him how wrong the Central Bank or officials can be - 5,000 versus 50,000. My God, you could not make it up.
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My socialist colleague over there. There are only two of us left.
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I would probably regret that.
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Is the Deputy sharing with Deputy Crowe?
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All right.
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